Southdale Area - Edina

[min-chi-cbus]

That's fine. Inching forward into the crosswalk is required to be able to see if it's safe to go. The issue I have is with drivers just pulling right into the crosswalk with their heads turned to the left for oncoming traffic. Like not stopping at the stop line first, then proceeding to inch out.

Guilty as charged! I've been caught doing that, and when it happens I simply just don't expect there to be a pedestrian trying to cross -- especially if there wasn't one there when I pulled up to the intersection.

This is probably the #1 reason cyclists and pedestrians get hit by vehicles. In an ideal world the driver would look first, but until then, just assume they won't.

[Anondson]

Meeting dates for the Southdale Area Planning Process work group. It's focus is particularly the west side of France Ave. The side where the 7200 France proposal created controversy.

http://current.mnsun.com/2015/04/france ... -meetings/

I'm fairly certain the work group has zero renters representing any residents of nearby apartments.

[Anondson]

Median "mood lights"?

https://twitter.com/edinacityman/status ... 0931447808

Anyone heard that term before?

[Anondson]

And in other news, Gordman's was officially announced as filling the Marshall's space.

[twincitizen]

Missed opportunity by the media there, as I noticed the sign in Southdale nearly two months ago

[Anondson]

I know. It even came across with a "BREAKING" to go with it this morning. Still, maybe some official benchmark was crossed, like signing a lease, not just promising.

[sdho]

Median "mood lights"?

https://twitter.com/edinacityman/status ... 0931447808

Anyone heard that term before?

They're finally in! Were supposed to be installed in December. Since they don't actually illuminate anything, I would have rather spent the money on boulevard trees for the barren grass strip next to the new sidewalk.

I asked the engineers last fall why there was no street lighting on such a major urban street, but apparently they determined that there are so many brightly lit parking lots, that the private sector was doing the work for them.

[Mdcastle]

They wanted to do the project as cheap as possible- they moved existing traffic signals and maintained the existing signal phasing rather than replace them and add flashing yellow arrows. So not surprised street lighting wasn't added.

[sdho]

They wanted to do the project as cheap as possible- they moved existing traffic signals and maintained the existing signal phasing rather than replace them and add flashing yellow arrows. So not surprised street lighting wasn't added.

On a street as wide/busy as France, I wonder if there's even the desire to include flashing yellow arrows. I know it's standard to include them (even if never switched on) as a matter of course now, but I doubt it would be a motivator to replace a functional older signal. A couple signals were replaced, at least one each at 76th and 66th.

I am surprised that they went cheap with the ped crossings, though -- since the main purpose was to improve ped access and safety. APS was not included at all on the project, although countdown timers were already installed.

[Mdcastle]

Originally they didn't want to include them with double left turn lanes or triple through lanes, but Mn/DOT is now including the capability in those situations. But Hennepin County is diverging into doing it's own thing with signals. They're still using painted poles, and have now adopted a streetlight arm that's used on the west coast, but nowhere else in Minnesota.

Woodbury is going as far as to change out all of their existing signals, even when no other work is planned.

[Anondson]

The citizen group finalized its recommendations for development principles in the Southdale area, for when to allow exceptions to the area plan.

http://blogs.edinamn.gov/development-pr ... southdale/

[mister.shoes]

The tower crane for this one joined the small forest of cranes at 66th and France a month or two ago and the foundation is already well underway.

Initial Project Description: Aurora Investments, LLC is proposing to construct a new, 209-unit senior care building, 228,842 square feet, five stories, plus one level of underground parking at 6500 France Ave. S. and 4005 W. 65th St., Edina, MN.

Drawings: http://edinamn.gov/edinafiles/files/Cit ... France.pdf

The France Ave frontage is actually pretty nice.

[twincitizen]

How would this proposal fit in to those guidelines: http://finance-commerce.com/2015/07/ban ... -in-edina/ ?

It's pretty much a 1:1 replacement of a drive-thru bank branch with a slightly larger bank. It's a shame they don't propose something a little more substantial on that site. Wouldn't mind at all if they proposed a hard corner, eliminating the free right from SB France to WB 69th

[Anondson]

I'd wished something like Highland Bank around Ridgedale or Bridgewater Bank at Excelsior and Grand was done at any or all of the three banks at this intersection.

Missed opportunity...

(Edit) That, and a few of those bullets are clearly in conflict with this proposal.

[twincitizen]

Gordman's opens for business: http://www.startribune.com/discount-cha ... 318069951/

Buried nugget also states there is a restaurant planned for the SW corner of the Southdale property, near the water tower. I don't know how much of a detractor the water tower itself could be, but it certainly seems like another apartment complex (with the restaurant at its base) would be a better use of the property than a single-use restaurant. Subtracting out the water tower area & providing some generous setbacks, you can still come up with 2-2.5 acres in that corner to develop (One Southdale Place parcel is 5 acres). Certainly enough room for a 4-6 story stick frame development.

Honestly though, I'd be reluctant to approve any more sit-down restaurant space in the area. Between everything that has been added to Southdale, and the potential for some of those chains to fail (looking at you Ruby Tuesday), it really seems close to the saturation point already. It has to be someone with deep pockets if they are willing to construct a new single-use restaurant building rather than hunt for an existing space in the area.

[Anondson]

That SW corner is little used during the week, except a few daring Galleria parkers, but fills up on weekends with theater parking.

The NE outlot never fills with parking, ever. Seems it's a wasteland space to stash machinery parts. It gets occasional use for remote art fair parking, or Cadillac dealer overflow storage.

[MNdible]

Isn't the NE outlot where they do most of their snow storage? I know that sounds like a ridiculous thing to take up land for, but it's a real thing when you're talking about clearing that much surface area.

[mister.shoes]

SW corner: add a second parking deck over the main theater lot, turn the entire triangular outlot into apartments (excluding the water tower, obviously).

NE corner: yep, mostly snow storage and machinery. It'd be nice to see that triangle AND the Schlotzsky's building redeveloped. Expand the JCP structured parking to make up for the lost spots (parking that's covered doesn't need to be plowed!)

NW corner/N side: SRSLY, no one ever parks up here. Redevelop 75% of it.

[twincitizen]

I still think Southdale missed a huge opportunity to downsize & sell of a good swath of land in the NE corner. Obviously Simon Properties isn't in the business of shrinking malls, but long-term I think it will bear out that it would've been the right thing to do at the time. Southdale is filling up spaces pretty nicely and everything, but I swear the foot traffic is still really light. It just never, ever seems busy in there. The restaurant/AMC side gets busy on weekend nights of course, but the mall traffic still seems pretty low.

My downsizing idea is as follows :
1. Instead of bringing in the Herbergers, shift JCPenney over to that space (former Mervyn's - was vacant for quite a while)
(obviously too late for this now, at least until JCP goes bankrupt).
2. Tear down the current JCP building and parking deck. The rebuilt food court could remain and be further reconstructed into a grand "front entrance", facing north towards 66th.
3. Sell entire NE quadrant of the Southdale property for office (including government), medical, and/or residential development. Introduce an L-shaped public street separating the NE corner property from the mall property, laying the foundation of a grid (basically Beard Ave & 67th Street). This probably involves rebuilding/relocating the transit center yet again, but whatevs this is all fantasy anyways.

[Anondson]

Nice fantasy list. I'd imagined if JCP goes under to tear down its building and construct offices right in its old space, keeping it attached to the main mall.

I even hope to see the berm built along York done something with. Bring the circulator road in a few dozen feet, build a parking cap over the east parking, and you have room to fit another six story apartment in the mid block of York.