Minneapolis Street Design
Minneapolis Street Design
I just read this article about street lighting in MInneapolis, and I think that street design is an important topic, especially with all the streets that are getting reconstructed. Minneapolis does have a terrible mishmash of street lights throughout the city, and it would be nice to start developing a strategy to get some consistency along different type of roads. For example, major commercial corridors would have one or two types of lights, residential streets another, ect...
Image from Minneapolis Street Lighting Policy
Additionally, it would be great if the city would encourage and promote more stand alone projects help get all street lights switched to LED. There are many places where this lighting is outdated, and it would be great to encourage people and neighborhoods to take on these projects themselves.
Stand-alone Street Lighting Project
Residential areas that are not likely to have the street reconstructed in the near future (within 5 years) are
able to have street lighting installed by opt-in petition and paying an assessment for the cost of
installation. Opting-in to a lighting project will follow a two-phase petition effort. Phase 1 will be used
to document general support and shall equal or exceed 35% within a six month time period. If
successful, then the Phase 2 petition is conducted via a formal petition mailing sent out from the City of
Minneapolis. In order to move forward with a street lighting project, 70% of the affected owners have
to agree to support and fund the project using the Uniform Street Lighting Assessment. Other funds
may be used to buy down the assessments such as grant dollars or neighborhood funds. The minimum
project size to install street lighting is 4 contiguous blocks, both sides of the street, in Residential areas.
Original Article
http://www.startribune.com/minneapolis- ... 371070301/
Image from Minneapolis Street Lighting Policy
Additionally, it would be great if the city would encourage and promote more stand alone projects help get all street lights switched to LED. There are many places where this lighting is outdated, and it would be great to encourage people and neighborhoods to take on these projects themselves.
Stand-alone Street Lighting Project
Residential areas that are not likely to have the street reconstructed in the near future (within 5 years) are
able to have street lighting installed by opt-in petition and paying an assessment for the cost of
installation. Opting-in to a lighting project will follow a two-phase petition effort. Phase 1 will be used
to document general support and shall equal or exceed 35% within a six month time period. If
successful, then the Phase 2 petition is conducted via a formal petition mailing sent out from the City of
Minneapolis. In order to move forward with a street lighting project, 70% of the affected owners have
to agree to support and fund the project using the Uniform Street Lighting Assessment. Other funds
may be used to buy down the assessments such as grant dollars or neighborhood funds. The minimum
project size to install street lighting is 4 contiguous blocks, both sides of the street, in Residential areas.
Original Article
http://www.startribune.com/minneapolis- ... 371070301/
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- Capella Tower
- Posts: 2869
- Joined: June 1st, 2012, 9:19 am
Re: Minneapolis Street Design
I say adopt the GE Lighting smart lighting technology, like they're doing in San Diego.....if they can manage the up-front investment:
http://www.nbcsandiego.com/news/tech/Sa ... 47791.html
http://www.nbcsandiego.com/news/tech/Sa ... 47791.html
Re: Minneapolis Street Design
At least Minneapolis has street lighting. Ever been to Woodbury? Even the main roads are dark.
Re: Minneapolis Street Design
Don't want to have lights shining in any windows or giving light to burglars. Like burglars don't have night vision googles for when they break into Woodbury homes at night for that very reason!! LOLAt least Minneapolis has street lighting. Ever been to Woodbury? Even the main roads are dark.
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- Stone Arch Bridge
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- Location: NORI: NOrth of RIchfield
Re: Minneapolis Street Design
Curious what people know about the Xcel LED streetlight conversion.
One big opportunity I see is better lighting in alleys. Most alleys in my neighborhood have 6 Xcel poles per block, with tall lights on every other pole (alley intersection, then two lights mid-alley). With the LED conversion, I'd like to see lights on every pole, at a lower location. This would allow for dark-sky friendly fixtures, less glare into windows, and more security in the alley itself.
One big opportunity I see is better lighting in alleys. Most alleys in my neighborhood have 6 Xcel poles per block, with tall lights on every other pole (alley intersection, then two lights mid-alley). With the LED conversion, I'd like to see lights on every pole, at a lower location. This would allow for dark-sky friendly fixtures, less glare into windows, and more security in the alley itself.
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- IDS Center
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- Location: Merriam Park, St. Paul
Re: Minneapolis Street Design
They're full cutoff sodium light is nice with zero window glare, which they'll install if it's requested, at least in St. Paul. Not sure how the LED cobras are shaping up, but it seems the city could lead that direction since they're the lessee.
Q. What, what? A. In da butt.
Re: Minneapolis Street Design
Buildings around the city have been routinely hit by cars. What are the best practices for protecting them? (Besides removing lanes. One place this is happening is Penn Ave N where it was already redone for the C line).
I was thinking safety bollards with LED's would be a good solution and could also be installed at busy bus stops to protect riders.
Is there anything else that is recommended?
I was thinking safety bollards with LED's would be a good solution and could also be installed at busy bus stops to protect riders.
Is there anything else that is recommended?
Re: Minneapolis Street Design
If Minneapolis wants to create safer streets maybe they could start by using smaller fire trucks. Narrowing roads will be hard to do when trucks like these need to use them.
https://media.kare11.com/assets/KARE/im ... 0x1080.jpg
https://media.kare11.com/assets/KARE/im ... 0x1080.jpg
Re: Minneapolis Street Design
The Fire Department has larger issuesIf Minneapolis wants to create safer streets maybe they could start by using smaller fire trucks. Narrowing roads will be hard to do when trucks like these need to use them.
https://media.kare11.com/assets/KARE/im ... 0x1080.jpg
Minneapolis fire chief: ‘We’re undermanned’
"Numbers provided by Minneapolis Fire Chief Bryan Tyner show the department had about 35,000 calls in 2007 with 434 sworn firefighters. Yet in 2022, when the number of calls had risen to around 55,000, staffing numbers remained the same — 434.
Tyner told 5 EYEWITNESS NEWS from year to year, those staffing numbers have even dipped.
“NFPA calls for us to have four firefighters on every rig, and right now, we’re only running three on the engines on most days,” Tyner said."
https://kstp.com/kstp-news/top-news/min ... dermanned/
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- Stone Arch Bridge
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Re: Minneapolis Street Design
I say this as a former candidate endorsed by Mpls firefighters union a decade ago, and without prejudice to the merit of their staffing or operations desires... but they've been bringing up those same points about NFPA standards since at least 2013.
What categories are those 55,000 calls in? How many of those categories warrant a 4-person rig to respond? How many categories may not need a fire response at all? Fires, car crashes, various types of medicals, etc. I don't know the answer but it's probably nuanced.
What categories are those 55,000 calls in? How many of those categories warrant a 4-person rig to respond? How many categories may not need a fire response at all? Fires, car crashes, various types of medicals, etc. I don't know the answer but it's probably nuanced.
Re: Minneapolis Street Design
If the city wants to save a bit of cash to hire a few more firefighters then smaller engines would save on the cost of the engine, the size of the garage to store the engine and fuel the move the engine. Narrower roads would cost less build and maintain, give room for bike paths or greenery and reduce pedestrian fatalities.The Fire Department has larger issuesIf Minneapolis wants to create safer streets maybe they could start by using smaller fire trucks. Narrowing roads will be hard to do when trucks like these need to use them.
https://media.kare11.com/assets/KARE/im ... 0x1080.jpg
Minneapolis fire chief: ‘We’re undermanned’
"Numbers provided by Minneapolis Fire Chief Bryan Tyner show the department had about 35,000 calls in 2007 with 434 sworn firefighters. Yet in 2022, when the number of calls had risen to around 55,000, staffing numbers remained the same — 434.
Tyner told 5 EYEWITNESS NEWS from year to year, those staffing numbers have even dipped.
“NFPA calls for us to have four firefighters on every rig, and right now, we’re only running three on the engines on most days,” Tyner said."
https://kstp.com/kstp-news/top-news/min ... dermanned/
Re: Minneapolis Street Design
Kind of doubt people will appreciate their houses burning down when the fire department shows up in a small cute vehicle instead of a honking big truck full of lots of water to spray before a hose line can be established. There's a reason firefighters drive big trucks and it's not because they want to show off. Then you have UPS and Fedex vehicles with the trend to online shopping, school buses, and moving trucks.
The actual calls are kind of irrelevant because you still need the capability to drive big trucks down the street in the event there's a house burning down, but I did keep a log of Bloomington / Edina / Richfield calls for the past week whenever I've been listening to the scanner:
Lift Assist aka "I've Fallen and I Can't get Up" ; 6
Medical: 24
Mental Health 2
Fire Alarm: 4 (The one that got me laughing was what they described as a "hot toaster" at the Extended Stay America
Carbon Monoxide Alarm: 1
Actual fires to put out: 0
The actual calls are kind of irrelevant because you still need the capability to drive big trucks down the street in the event there's a house burning down, but I did keep a log of Bloomington / Edina / Richfield calls for the past week whenever I've been listening to the scanner:
Lift Assist aka "I've Fallen and I Can't get Up" ; 6
Medical: 24
Mental Health 2
Fire Alarm: 4 (The one that got me laughing was what they described as a "hot toaster" at the Extended Stay America
Carbon Monoxide Alarm: 1
Actual fires to put out: 0
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- IDS Center
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Re: Minneapolis Street Design
This thought process would imply that every other country that uses these has a total Armageddon of just burning homes and buildings... which they don't. And yes, they have tall buildings too. Crazy stuff.
Re: Minneapolis Street Design
Honestly, right now we need people to just follow the traffic laws. You want less pedestrian and cycling deaths..then maybe they should follow the laws?
I got into an argument with a cyclist when running as I watched a light turn green and right after it turns green he goes in front of 3 lanes of cars blocking them from the green light. They clearly had the right away. He didn't get hit, but if one of those lanes was clear and a car was approaching at the speed limit or faster he would have been hurt bad.
Also when running to work today a driver got out of his car, honked and started yelling and banging and cussing out one of those new Metro Transit Mini buses because it ran a sign and almost hit him. He started lecturing the driver about how there are too many accidents in the neighborhood and he was clearly pissed.
Folks in my area stop when they dont' have a sign and look to see if someone is going to run the stop sign.
Who cares about infrastructure and fire trucks if folks negligent.
I got into an argument with a cyclist when running as I watched a light turn green and right after it turns green he goes in front of 3 lanes of cars blocking them from the green light. They clearly had the right away. He didn't get hit, but if one of those lanes was clear and a car was approaching at the speed limit or faster he would have been hurt bad.
Also when running to work today a driver got out of his car, honked and started yelling and banging and cussing out one of those new Metro Transit Mini buses because it ran a sign and almost hit him. He started lecturing the driver about how there are too many accidents in the neighborhood and he was clearly pissed.
Folks in my area stop when they dont' have a sign and look to see if someone is going to run the stop sign.
Who cares about infrastructure and fire trucks if folks negligent.
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- Foshay Tower
- Posts: 981
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Re: Minneapolis Street Design
It's the same thought process that leads us to immediately dismiss any innovations or processes from abroad because "the US is different." For reasons that are rarely elaborated on or based in fact.This thought process would imply that every other country that uses these has a total Armageddon of just burning homes and buildings... which they don't. And yes, they have tall buildings too. Crazy stuff.
Re: Minneapolis Street Design
Laws don't fix bad design.
Re: Minneapolis Street Design
Minneapolis hasn't had a traffic enforcement division since pre covid/GF. And with MPD's depleted numbers I doubt traffic enforcement is high on their to do list. If smaller firetrucks, raised crosswalks and narrower streets can slow traffic and save lives why not do it?
I'm not sure if MFD is advocating for it but I'd think sprinklers would save more lives than a large firetruck or a 4th firefighter.
I'm not sure if MFD is advocating for it but I'd think sprinklers would save more lives than a large firetruck or a 4th firefighter.
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- Landmark Center
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Re: Minneapolis Street Design
Can someone who's advocating for smaller fire trucks post a link or a picture? Are we talking about a ladder mounted on a Ford Transit van?
Everywhere I've traveled in the US and Europe the fire trucks look the same size as the Minneapolis ones.
Everywhere I've traveled in the US and Europe the fire trucks look the same size as the Minneapolis ones.
Re: Minneapolis Street Design
I am in no way an expert, but here are two pieces that lay out some differences:
https://www.firerescue1.com/fire-produc ... O7PZokQVp/
https://www.fireapparatusmagazine.com/f ... rope/#gref
Looks like their trucks are still full service fire trucks, but can be up to half the length and a bit narrower than ours.
https://www.firerescue1.com/fire-produc ... O7PZokQVp/
https://www.fireapparatusmagazine.com/f ... rope/#gref
Looks like their trucks are still full service fire trucks, but can be up to half the length and a bit narrower than ours.
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